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Getting Kendama into Gym Curriculums

Discussion in 'The Sesh' started by Cheech_Sander, Jan 27, 2017.

  1. Cheech_Sander

    Cheech_Sander Administrator Staff Member

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    Los Angeles, CA
    Just wondering what the DS community thinks of this idea.
    Some of the larger kendama companies are working on getting kendama into high school or middle school gym curriculums. The benefits are obvious; introduce more people to kendama, bulk orders, and massive scale. There are 15 million high schoolers each year.

    But would it lose the cool factor if you were forced to do it for gym class? Has it already lost the cool factor?

    What do you guys think?
     
    Jan 27, 2017
  2. KeeganS

    KeeganS DS Legend

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    Location:
    Boise, Idaho
    I work at an after school community center with elementary to jr high/middle school aged students. I mostly work with the elementary students, especially grades 1st through 4th.
    They're always so interested when I have my kendama out and am trying new tricks or just trying to get in a quick practice. I even have approval from my boss to move the weekly kendama club nights I used to help out with at another location to the community center on Friday nights.
    We even had a couple times where David Bazan (yo yo legend) had myself and a couple other local kendama players and yo yo players come to the community center accompanied by yo yo and/or kendama pros (@DaveMateo being one of them) and doing a quick show for the kids there.

    That said, I think it would be better to introduce kendama into gym/P.E. classes at around the elementary level. They seem to have more of a fascination with skill toys like yo yo and kendama at that age than at the older grade levels when introduced through the schools.

    Example, I was in about the 3rd or 4th grade when a group of yo yo players came to my elementary school and did a show for all of the students at the school. After that, you could find at least half of that grade group on one area of the blacktop just trying to do the yo yo tricks we all saw from that performance. Not a lot, if not all of us really kept at it (I know I didn't) after a couple weeks but I definitely remember just being so mesmerized and absolutely impressed with the skills those players had back then (I think this is even before the yo yo competitions were implemented the way they are now). But a number of yo yo pros now were introduced to it that exact same way.

    So, I totally think that introducing kendama into the school system would be a fantastic idea. At the elementary age, doing it as part of their P.E. course (like juggling, dancing, etc) would be a fantastic idea.
    In the middle school through high school levels, I've seen instances where teachers and/or students who were already involved with kendama started their own kendama club for after school/free hour. I think that is a better way to include kendama in schools at that level and it's less forceful than doing it in P.E. with the elementary aged kids. I think if you kind of force it onto students in that way at that age, it's easier for them to lose interest in it. At least that's what I've seen from my trying to engage a couple of the teens with kendama at my community center.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2017
    Jan 27, 2017
  3. htimSxelA

    htimSxelA Moderator Staff Member

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    Vancouver
    I agree with what @KeeganS said, I think its net positive overall.

    I wanna make a snide remark like "if skateboarding can be in the Olympics, dama can be in elementary gym class", but I think there actually is an interesting conversation to be had here.


    I think one of the most important factors is "what do people find when they google search kendama?"

    If they find a bunch of elementary lesson programs... well, thats not too appealing to a larger audience.
    If they find some KROM'd out video of Bonz doing ridiculous stuff, well I think thats enticing, and worth following up on. (ie. coool)

    Considering how robust the online community is, there is no shortage of great content to find. The days of the concerted marketing push being the whole face of a company / game / etc are gone. As long as the main industry players and content creators don't change what they're doing to cater to the young kid (ie not cooool) audience, I think we're safe.
     
    Jan 27, 2017
  4. Ben Lowe

    Ben Lowe Slayer

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    *immediately starts working on Barney-eque kids kendama show* :p:rolleyes:;)
     
    Jan 27, 2017
  5. KeeganS

    KeeganS DS Legend

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    Dec 6, 2016
    Location:
    Boise, Idaho
    *starts moshikame-ing to Barney theme song
     
    Jan 27, 2017
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  6. theligitchriswhit

    theligitchriswhit Honed Member

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    Dec 22, 2016
    Location:
    Norcross GA
    Well in my elementary school I did juggling and Kendama is kind of a form of juggling so I guess they could add it to school curriculum.
     
    Jan 28, 2017
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  7. RyanArthurWalker

    RyanArthurWalker Slayer

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    I have tons of positive things to say about the possible inclusion of Kendama into a PHYSICAL EDUCATION curriculum... ;)

    ...however, there are a few things that need to be addressed before that is made a reality.


    1) Kendamas are not durable.
    I teach 150 kids every day, as does the other PE teacher at my school. (for the first half of the year, then I get a new 150 the second half) I have 4 classes a day that are an hour and 15 minutes long. A standard kendama (maybe maple) would not hold up well to that type of punishment, especially against new players. Using my example, if we have approximately 600 kids using kendamas every year, it is a stretch to assume that those damas will be playable the next year

    2) Cost.
    Kendamas are expensive and PE departments don't always have solid budgets. In many school districts the budget for all electives may be lumped together, which means that PE, Art, Music, Digital Media, Drama, etc share from the same pool of money. Assuming your class size is approx. 22, which for PE is a generous average, you are looking at an order of around $400 for a class set. (potentially more)

    I have written curriculum before but it is important to remember that...

    2.5) Teachers are observed.
    In this new-era of education the teacher are scored on whether or not their teaching was effective. This can affect their job status in the future or potential raises at the end of the year. In order to have Kendama as part of the curriculum there needs to be an objective to the end of the unit that is measurable by an assessment from the teacher. (could be written, peer assessed, video assessment, etc) Defining an end point for the lesson would be incredibly important, as well as being dependent on the length of the unit.

    The reason I bring this up is because, in theory, it would be important that all kendama curriculum was written in a common language, style and timeline. This would assure that students in all parts of the US/World would be learning the same basic building blocks to set themselves up for their future in Kendama.

    3) Connections to the "real world"
    Now, more than ever schools are focusing their attention on connecting all content to real world scenarios. (incredibly important in my opinion) With that being said, there needs to be a connection for Kendama. Maybe a Social Studies angle, through the studying of Japan.

    3.5) Do not sell Kendama as a game that "improves hand-eye coordination." Until we, the kendama community, have definitive proof (through a legitimate study) that hand-eye coordination has been increased through the use of Kendama, it will not support our claim that it would be great for kids to learn. Kendama skills may not necessarily increase use of a baseball bat, tennis racket, writing or even hand-eye coordination in juggling, it is a phenomenon that people "feel" but have not proved true. I know we have all heard 100's of people use that as an initial introduction to Kendama but testing hand-eye coordination would be damn near impossible in class.

    Lastly, I know there are PE teachers out there already who are implementing Kendama in their classes and I am stoked that they are making the most of it! These are just a few of my thoughts from my teacher brain on what we need to address as a community in order to ensure that Kendama can be brought to ANY school in the US by any teacher. (the curriculum should be able to be taught by someone who has never seen or used a kendama)

    (Also, I think elementary or middle school would be the best place for Kendama to be taught)
     
    Jan 28, 2017
  8. Ian

    Ian Member

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    Toledo,OH
    Alot of people are bummmed on this though.
     
    Jan 28, 2017
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  9. Blake W.

    Blake W. Honed Member

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    Nov 5, 2016
    Last year our PE teacher kind of tried to introduce it, due to the fact that Bonz is one of my classmates' cousins and he came and sparked dama at my school. It worked pretty well, but everyone is tired of it, so no chance this year ;(
     
    Jan 28, 2017
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  10. htimSxelA

    htimSxelA Moderator Staff Member

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    Yea, definitely so, I think you missed my joke. The Olympics are the antithesis of skateboard culture.
     
    Jan 28, 2017
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  11. Ian

    Ian Member

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    Jan 7, 2017
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    Yeah exactly. I got it. I just feel like it would do the same thing with Dama. It's more of an artistic expression rather than a pyshical sport. With outsiders judging what's good and not good. That's why the ken world is sweet because it's very tight knit with comps or events
     
    Jan 28, 2017
  12. cbwalsh24

    cbwalsh24 Honed Member

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    Oct 12, 2016
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    Cape Town, South Africa
    Hmm.. I'm more of a firm believer in this to be a legitimate benefit of playing kendama, regardless of the absent scientific data or proof.

    I'm not even sure how it could be accurately tested and assessed, but off my personal experiences.. Almost three years of playing kendama and baseball at the same time, without a doubt it has notably assisted in not only hand-eye coordination, but particularly throwing arm strength and conditioning. Along with general reaction times, visualizing movements, precise balance, and controlling a heart rate.

    I know the lack of science trumps my notion, but that doesn't make any less difference to me because I know it to be true.
     
    Jan 28, 2017
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  13. htimSxelA

    htimSxelA Moderator Staff Member

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    @RyanArthurWalker what sort of proof is the usual standard? As in, what would define a legitimate study?

    Also, RE: your point 1), I've seen some bins of kendamas in Japanese classrooms that are like 20 years old, and they've been used weekly throughout that time. The damas are thrashed, but the kids still use them, and they work.
     
    Jan 28, 2017
  14. Chad Covington

    Chad Covington Slayer

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    I absolutely love the thouroughness from @RyanArthurWalker and insight from a teacher's perspective! I'd say that Ryan covers a very broad/blanket approach to getting kendama into Physical Education courses, whereas some people have gone in and taught one class at one school (Most likely made possible through knowing someone in the administration). Maybe the approach shouldn't be to reach millions of students, or even thousands! Hundreds might be a more sustainable number, especially if we're trying to preserve the culture and "coolness" of kendama.
     
    Jan 29, 2017
  15. RyanArthurWalker

    RyanArthurWalker Slayer

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    I hear you. However, if you look at "transfer of learning" and the studies behind it, it basically states that skills may transfer when the skill being performed is similar to a previously mastered skill. Issues arise however because Kendama is a highly skilled game that consists of precise fine motor functions as well as a healthy mix of gross motor control and proprioception. With that being said, you wouldn't practice lay-ups on the basketball court and expect your kendama technique to get better. Those skills have no correlation. You may have an argument for something like cup stacking or juggling, but the skills you use on the baseball diamond and the skills you use in Kendama have little to no crossover, physically mind you.

    To be fair, has your workout changed in these three years? Has your diet changed? Sleeping habits? Deliberate practice? Etc? All of these factors can also increase your success on the baseball diamond. Until there is some empirical data recorded, it's difficult to make that correlation. I wouldn't know exactly how to set up a kendama study, however I think the right place to start would be with programs like Dartfish, where you can assess the movement of the player. (Commonly used by professionals and Biomechanists) From there you could determine a control group (of skills) and have two groups; one that deliberately practices (I think of Japanese style. Methodical.) and a group that plays with no goal in mind. (freestyle). Would be interesting to see what changes. (issues will arise from current skill levels. Causing the data to be skewed. you would have to run the data to see if that is negligible)

    It makes me think about how Baseball players used to (or maybe still do) warm-up with a weight on the bat when there is no significant data that proves it will help with your upcoming at bat. Instead, if you want to warm-up appropriately, you should warm-up in a situation that is as close to the situation you will be facing as possible. Does that make sense?

    Coming from a teacher, the statement "....but that doesn't make any less difference to me because I know it to be true," is troubling. That simply would not fly in the classroom. Whether you were talking to a child, parent, administrator, etc.

    I am not trying to attack you by any means and I value your opinions on the topic. I am simply responding to what you wrote here and trying to explain my point of view. Thanks for the discussion.


    I would love to get that experience and see how the Japanese students/teachers use the equipment. This is a great thing to hear though. Hopefully some of the teachers who are working with Sweets right now can weigh in on the topic later!

    In terms of standards, check this link to see the US National Standards for Health and PE. Every lesson I teach falls under one of these standards;

    Standard 1. The physically literate individual demonstrates competency in a variety of motor skills and movement patterns.
    Standard 2. The physically literate individual applies knowledge of concepts, principles,strategies and tactics related to movement and performance.
    Standard 3. The physically literate individual demonstrates the knowledge and skills to achieve and maintain a health-enhancing level of physical activity and fitness.
    Standard 4. The physically literate individual exhibits responsible personal and social behavior that respects self and others.
    Standard 5. The physically literate individual recognizes the value of physical activity for health, enjoyment, challenge, self-expression and/or social interaction.

    I think the argument could be made that a piece of Kendama falls into each of these Standards and that is important. When you dive a bit deeper and look at the grade level outcomes. (in plain speak "what the kid will be able to do by the end of the year) For elementary school it might fall under "S1.E27 - manipulatives" They currently only have jump rope listed and the 5th grade outcome is "creates a jump rope routine with a partner, using either a long or short rope." I could see Kendama being used in a similar way. "create a kendama pattern that can be taught to a partner and demonstrated for the class." Something along those lines.

    Without going too much deeper, the reason why I think it would fit well into an Elementary curriculum is because of how curriculum is usually mapped out.

    Elementary PE - Movement Concepts/Motor Control (controlling implements, locomotor movements like running, skipping, hopping)
    Middle School PE - Team Sports/Individual Sports (think soccer, basketball, badminton, ultimate frisbee)
    High School PE - Lifetime Fitness Activities (i.e. Swimming, Tennis, Hiking, Cycling, general fitness)

    Kendama is clearly manipulating and object and that is what Elementary school PE is all about. If a study were done Alex I think it would need to be run by a legitimate university or group of scientists with no connection to the Kendama world. I argue this point because I think that it would start to legitimize kendama to administration. It would be a support beam for teachers to fall back on when administrators might question why we would want to spend our money on that equipment.

    Thanks Chad. I agree, I am covering a broad basis and maybe talking about what Kendama could look like for an entire population as opposed to one class here or there. To address your second statement, when I lived in Germany, they had a word at the University for activities like Kendama. They called is "fadsport." This included things like Skateboarding, rollerblading and parkour and I think it would work for Kendama. It definitely is a fad to the majority of people who pick it up but I don't think that should stop us from introducing it to as large a group of people as possible. It may lose it's "cool-ness" in some ways but I think more good than harm will come from it.

    /endrant
     
    Jan 30, 2017
  16. cbwalsh24

    cbwalsh24 Honed Member

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    Cape Town, South Africa
    Not taken as an attack whatsoever, it's cool being able to converse with business owners and players of our community. I understand your need for definitive proof, before being able to regard kendama as scientifically beneficial in anyway. I wasn't trying to make a troubling statement, but just adding my own observations and two cents.

    One of my biggest correlations though would be the hand and arm movements required to play kendama, which similarly resemble the actions of pronation. Your arm pronates when throwing a baseball. Pronation often causes arm pains in pitchers and tennis players, commonly known as tennis elbow. Obviously kendama and baseball involve very different motions, but I'm certain kendama has helped strengthen and improve flexibility out of the smaller more intricate muscles in my arm. The smaller muscles running from your shoulder to your elbow, through to your forearm and down to your hand are crucial for protecting the overall health of your arm.

    Kendama has literally rid me of any and all arm pain, which I used to have persistently playing baseball before kendama was introduced to me. I noticed after my first season of consistently playing that it started resulting in quicker warm ups, improved endurance, better arm action, and limited arm soreness after pitching. Even more noticeable was my positive increase in statistics, including my ERA, AVG, OBP, and RISP.

    I went from a walk-on bench player to earning Rawling's D1 "All Atlantic" ;) Team nomination and I know for a fact kendama was a contributor in achieving that accolade. I'm playing in Australia now and dream of playing in Japan one day.

    As a teacher and leader in our community, I wouldn't be so quick to discount this toy's underlying abilities just because a lack of scientific testing. Instead, let's put some heads together and determine if it could be accurately tested and eventually proven true!
     
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2017
    Jan 30, 2017
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  17. RyanArthurWalker

    RyanArthurWalker Slayer

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    Well said, but I think you are still missing my point. In no way am I discounting "this toy's underlying abilities," but rather, I am presenting to you the walls that we may face on the road to implementation of a Kendama curriculum into a school/district. Again, your success in baseball being attributed to your use of a Kendama is subjective. I am delighted to see how much joy it has brought you in more than one facet of your life and I hope it continues to bring you success. Playing Baseball at the next level is an incredible feat and I wish you the best.

    When it comes to a school curriculum we can't rely on something that is subjective, that is like building a house on sand. We need to rely on something/or someone who is objective. For that, we need proof. I am positive that there are bright minds within the community who are able to go beyond what I have proposed and create something that will benefit the next generation of Kendama players. For now, it may be that Kendama is best suited as an after school program or club.

    Also, Wouldn't pronation be more beneficial to a pitchers' elbow? Hasn't the long argued "young kids shouldn't throw curveballs" debate been about the supination of the forearm which can causes fractures/splinters in the Ulna? Correct me if I am wrong but I believe I remember learning about that in A&P.
     
    Jan 30, 2017
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  18. Cheech_Sander

    Cheech_Sander Administrator Staff Member

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    Los Angeles, CA
    I can only imagine the mind-numbing red tape in instituting something as simple as japanese cup and ball to a public education institution
     
    Jan 30, 2017
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  19. KeeganS

    KeeganS DS Legend

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    Boise, Idaho
    After reading and going through @RyanArthurWalker's posts I find myself agreeing with his perspective of the difficulties in introducing kendama as part of school/P.E. curriculum. It'll be difficult, especially if you plan on supplying the kendamas yourself.
    Yes, bulk deals for cheap are out there and like @htimSxelA has said there are some that Japanese schools have used that survived continuous use over the years. My concern is kids not being very honest and forthcoming and taking/stealing from the damas supplied. That happened when we had Dave Mateo come do a workshop at my community center and him and Dave Bazan left with one kendama missing. Sure, it's probably not that big of a probability to happen but it's still a possibility. Which is why I'm a bit hesitant to have my supervisor buy even the cheap bulk buys on sites like AliBaba. I'm more comfortable letting the kids use my throwaway kens than my boss wasting money. But that's just my point of view with that regard.

    I'm absolutely excited to start my kendama club there at the community center though, hopefully some kids there will be introduced to a new game that they'll grow to really love like we do and it'll be awesome to see all the other Boise players again.
    I think implementing after school clubs like this would be a far better option than trying to include kendama in the curriculum. Again, it's not as forced as putting it in the curriculum so kids probably wont feel as burned out on it. If there's already an after school program like where I'm coming from it'll probably be a lot easier to start it up, especially if the kids there have even a faint interest in it. Plus it'll probably encourage kids to bring their kendamas to school if they dont already which will introduce it to their school in a bit more natural way than straight out asking out of the blue to bring this random toy in as a substitute to juggling or dance in P.E.

    Dont have much else to add, so there's the rest of my 2 cents.
     
    Jan 30, 2017
  20. RyanArthurWalker

    RyanArthurWalker Slayer

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    My critical analysis sure paints that picture ;)

    Seriously though, I'm really just putting up the most red tape so that a great curriculum could be created!

    I agree with some other people who commented on this post that an afterschool program might be perfect launch point for Kendama in schools.
     
    Jan 30, 2017
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